Discussion:
Strange Sovtek 5881 --- what is it??
(too old to reply)
maxhifi
2008-01-31 01:19:34 UTC
Permalink
I recently examined a quad of 5881's which were original to a Traynor
guitar amp. One of the had failed, so the quad was pulled a couple years
ago. I noticed that the failed one was quite different from the other 3,
and in fact different from all of the other Sovtek 5881's I have in my
posession, and also that I can see online.

Anyone know what this thing is?

picture at alt.binaries.pictures.radio
Phil Allison
2008-01-31 02:12:03 UTC
Permalink
"maxhifi"
Post by maxhifi
Anyone know what this thing is?
picture at alt.binaries.pictures.radio
** Try posting it on ABSE.




......... Phil
maxhifi
2008-01-31 02:17:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Phil Allison
"maxhifi"
Post by maxhifi
Anyone know what this thing is?
picture at alt.binaries.pictures.radio
** Try posting it on ABSE.
......... Phil
done
Phil Allison
2008-01-31 02:48:31 UTC
Permalink
"maxhifi"
Post by Phil Allison
Post by maxhifi
Anyone know what this thing is?
picture at alt.binaries.pictures.radio
** Try posting it on ABSE.
......... Phil
done
** You gotta be kidding !!

That is a horrible, blurry mess, not a pic.



......... Phil
maxhifi
2008-01-31 03:12:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Phil Allison
"maxhifi"
Post by Phil Allison
Post by maxhifi
Anyone know what this thing is?
picture at alt.binaries.pictures.radio
** Try posting it on ABSE.
......... Phil
done
** You gotta be kidding !!
That is a horrible, blurry mess, not a pic.
......... Phil
I added another photo - this photo shows up the difference in plate
structure much better. Still a bad picture, but maybe more useful.
Phil Allison
2008-01-31 03:51:03 UTC
Permalink
"maxhifi"

" I recently examined a quad of 5881's which were original to a Traynor
guitar amp. One of the had failed, so the quad was pulled a couple years
ago. I noticed that the failed one was quite different from the other 3,
and in fact different from all of the other Sovtek 5881's I have in my
posession, and also that I can see online. "

" Anyone know what this thing is?

picture at alt.binaries.pictures.radio "
Post by maxhifi
Post by Phil Allison
** You gotta be kidding !!
That is a horrible, blurry mess, not a pic.
I added another photo - this photo shows up the difference in plate
structure much better. Still a bad picture, but maybe more useful.
** The number " 6L6GB" and brand " Sovtek" are ON the glass !!!

So it ain't a fucking 5881 at all !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


So WTF else did you want to know ???????????




....... Phil
West
2008-01-31 05:03:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Phil Allison
"maxhifi"
" I recently examined a quad of 5881's which were original to a Traynor
guitar amp. One of the had failed, so the quad was pulled a couple years
ago. I noticed that the failed one was quite different from the other 3,
and in fact different from all of the other Sovtek 5881's I have in my
posession, and also that I can see online. "
" Anyone know what this thing is?
picture at alt.binaries.pictures.radio "
Post by maxhifi
Post by Phil Allison
** You gotta be kidding !!
That is a horrible, blurry mess, not a pic.
I added another photo - this photo shows up the difference in plate
structure much better. Still a bad picture, but maybe more useful.
** The number " 6L6GB" and brand " Sovtek" are ON the glass !!!
So it ain't a fucking 5881 at all !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So WTF else did you want to know ???????????
Perhaps the time?
ROTFLMAO

west
Post by Phil Allison
....... Phil
maxhifi
2008-01-31 07:09:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Phil Allison
"maxhifi"
" I recently examined a quad of 5881's which were original to a Traynor
guitar amp. One of the had failed, so the quad was pulled a couple years
ago. I noticed that the failed one was quite different from the other 3,
and in fact different from all of the other Sovtek 5881's I have in my
posession, and also that I can see online. "
" Anyone know what this thing is?
picture at alt.binaries.pictures.radio "
Post by maxhifi
Post by Phil Allison
** You gotta be kidding !!
That is a horrible, blurry mess, not a pic.
I added another photo - this photo shows up the difference in plate
structure much better. Still a bad picture, but maybe more useful.
** The number " 6L6GB" and brand " Sovtek" are ON the glass !!!
So it ain't a fucking 5881 at all !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So WTF else did you want to know ???????????
....... Phil
Actually, I disregarded that most important piece of info, as I've seen the
original 6P3EV (as well as plenty of other new production tubes) with a
million different names on them.

I had no idea they (Reflektor) were stuffing anything other than the guts of
the original 6P3EV into those envelopes. A google search reveals that the
"strange" 6P3EV I found in my mis-matched quad, is actually an update, as
follows:

"Modeled after the vintage RCA 6L6GC "Blackplate" the Sovtek 6L6WXT+
features larger plate dimensions and improved grid structure for increased
power handling capabilities. The 6L6WXT+ also features mica spacers with
metal springs to eliminate tube rattle and microphonics."
Phil Allison
2008-01-31 08:06:00 UTC
Permalink
"maxhifi" = drugged out mad man
Post by maxhifi
Post by Phil Allison
** The number " 6L6GB" and brand " Sovtek" are ON the glass !!!
So it ain't a fucking 5881 at all !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So WTF else did you want to know ???????????
Actually, I disregarded that most important piece of info, as I've seen the
original 6P3EV (as well as plenty of other new production tubes) with a
million different names on them.
** What the fuck are you crapping on about ?

Russian made 5881s are based on the US design 5881 as once made by GE and
Sylvania - it's an uprated 6L6GC.
Post by maxhifi
I had no idea they (Reflektor) were stuffing anything other than the guts of
the original 6P3EV into those envelopes. A google search reveals that the
"strange" 6P3EV I found in my mis-matched quad, is actually an update, as
"Modeled after the vintage RCA 6L6GC "Blackplate" the Sovtek 6L6WXT+
(snip shite)


** Which is not the same tube as your damn 6L6GB !!!

Marketing blurbs are all bullshit.

NEVER quote them as fact !!!!




....... Phil
robert casey
2008-01-31 21:17:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Phil Allison
** What the fuck are you crapping on about ?
Russian made 5881s are based on the US design 5881 as once made by GE and
Sylvania - it's an uprated 6L6GC.
Which means that you should never place a 6L6 into a circuit that was
designed for a 5881. However, you could use a 5881 in a circuit
designed for a 6L6.
Phil Allison
2008-01-31 23:11:23 UTC
Permalink
"robert casey congenital troll"
Post by robert casey
Post by Phil Allison
** What the fuck are you crapping on about ?
Russian made 5881s are based on the US design 5881 as once made by GE and
Sylvania - it's an uprated 6L6GC.
Which means that you should never place a 6L6 into a circuit that was
designed for a 5881. However, you could use a 5881 in a circuit designed
for a 6L6.
** Not true at all.

Sylvania 6L6GCs out perform Sovtek 5881s quite considerably.

Reason being it is really a Sylvania 7027 with the pins reconfigured to 6L6
format.

The part number on the glass means less than the maker and the vintage.



....... Phil
Patrick Turner
2008-02-01 14:27:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Phil Allison
"robert casey congenital troll"
Post by robert casey
Post by Phil Allison
** What the fuck are you crapping on about ?
Russian made 5881s are based on the US design 5881 as once made by GE and
Sylvania - it's an uprated 6L6GC.
Which means that you should never place a 6L6 into a circuit that was
designed for a 5881. However, you could use a 5881 in a circuit designed
for a 6L6.
** Not true at all.
Sylvania 6L6GCs out perform Sovtek 5881s quite considerably.
Reason being it is really a Sylvania 7027 with the pins reconfigured to 6L6
format.
The part number on the glass means less than the maker and the vintage.
....... Phil
I have one lone RCA 5881 which is hardly any bigger than a standard
small size 6V6.

There is much variation in the 6L6, 5881 family of tubes.

Never assume you can sub the tubes indiscriminately.

Didn't the 5881 originally have a trimetal layered anode material
it was impossible to get anode hot spots, and thus make the tube able to
take far greater bashing ?

But I doubt russian 5881 have the tri-metal anode material.

If any one tests KT88, 6550 made by one American-Russian enterprize,
you might find the innards look exactly the same and measure
identically, and all that's different
is the glass and writing on it; and it is all to get better market
acceptance and a higher price.

Since 1960, the number of varieties of 6L6 / 5881 have declined, and
we have only the russian makers left so get used to
the tubes being just what they are and nothing more.

I myself like russian output tubes in hi-fi amps where they seem to last
and sound OK
providing you don't bias them too high or grossly overload them,
or have an RL that is way too low, or have a design that does not allow
individual bias setting.

Back in 1960, tubes could and did fail if they were driven too hard with
a wrong load.

Patrick Turner.
François Yves Le Gal
2008-02-01 14:46:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Patrick Turner
Since 1960, the number of varieties of 6L6 / 5881 have declined, and
we have only the russian makers left so get used to
the tubes being just what they are and nothing more.
There are currently two Russian sources (Reflektor JSC - tubes sold under
the Sovtek, EH, Tung Sol, Svetlana - S -, as well as OEM. brands - and
Svetlana JSC - either sold under SED =C= or Svetlana =C= brands), one
Chinese (Shuguang, with tubes sold under a myriad of brands and references)
and one Slovakian (JJ).
Bret Ludwig
2008-02-03 01:58:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Patrick Turner
I myself like russian output tubes in hi-fi amps where they seem to last
and sound OK
providing you don't bias them too high or grossly overload them,
or have an RL that is way too low, or have a design that does not allow
individual bias setting.
Back in 1960, tubes could and did fail if they were driven too hard with
a wrong load.
The Russians built very good tubes in the sense they were very good
for the purposes which they were intended. In some cases that had
nothing to do with what we think they should be good for. They were
often differently specified than their Western counterparts.

maxhifi
2008-02-01 03:20:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Phil Allison
** What the fuck are you crapping on about ?
Russian made 5881s are based on the US design 5881 as once made by GE and
Sylvania - it's an uprated 6L6GC.
No, it is not. The first Russian 6L6, made in 1939, was an almost exact copy of
the RCA 6L6G.

This was later replaced with a globe shaped tube called a 6P3, which was a short
looking version of a 6L6G. The "Coke Bottle" Chinese "6L6GC" seen in the early
90s, and well known for its short life, is a copy of an early Russian 6P3.

The 6P3S, is a tubular version of the 6P3. This was sold by Sovtek also, as a
"6L6GC", and also as 6L6GT by other rebranders.

This brings us to the 6P3EV, which was originally called the 1540, and came out
in about 1959 (earliest I've seen), for use as a servo amplifier in military
applications. It is a 6P3, with higher ratings.

This is the tube which Sovtek marketed as the "5881" in North America. The only
thing it shares in common with the Tung Sol 5881, is the fact that both of them
are based on the 6L6.

The "coin base" 5881 was later updated to have a normal tube base, so it fits in
the tube clamps in Fender amplifiers, but is still essentially the same as the
original 1959 6P3EV.
Post by Phil Allison
Post by maxhifi
I had no idea they (Reflektor) were stuffing anything other than the guts of
the original 6P3EV into those envelopes. A google search reveals that the
"strange" 6P3EV I found in my mis-matched quad, is actually an update, as
"Modeled after the vintage RCA 6L6GC "Blackplate" the Sovtek 6L6WXT+
(snip shite)
** Which is not the same tube as your damn 6L6GB !!!
Marketing blurbs are all bullshit.
NEVER quote them as fact !!!!
....... Phil
If you look at photos you can discover through a simple web search, you will see
that the internal structure of the 6L6WXT+ appears identical to the "6L6GB" I
have. If there's some subtle differences inside, so be it, or maybe they're
factory seconds.
Phil Allison
2008-02-01 04:06:50 UTC
Permalink
"maxhifi"
Post by maxhifi
Post by Phil Allison
** What the fuck are you crapping on about ?
Russian made 5881s are based on the US design 5881 as once made by GE and
Sylvania - it's an uprated 6L6GC.
This brings us to the 6P3EV, which was originally called the 1540, and came out
in about 1959 (earliest I've seen), for use as a servo amplifier in military
applications. It is a 6P3, with higher ratings.
This is the tube which Sovtek marketed as the "5881" in North America. The only
thing it shares in common with the Tung Sol 5881, is the fact that both of them
are based on the 6L6.
** And all this info come from where ?

Fuckwits on tube web forums??
Post by maxhifi
Post by Phil Allison
"Modeled after the vintage RCA 6L6GC "Blackplate" the Sovtek 6L6WXT+
(snip shite)
** Which is not the same tube as your damn 6L6GB !!!
Marketing blurbs are all bullshit.
NEVER quote them as fact !!!!
If you look at photos you can discover through a simple web search, you will see
that the internal structure of the 6L6WXT+ appears identical to the "6L6GB" I
have. If there's some subtle differences inside, so be it, or maybe they're
factory seconds.
** Appearances are not the last word.

You made a COLOSSAL blunder here - admit it.

And get yourself a digital camera that FUCKING WORKS !!!!




........ Phil
maxhifi
2008-02-01 05:26:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Phil Allison
** And all this info come from where ?
When I was in Eastern Europe, I had an acquaintance who worked at a Soviet test
equipment company as an engineer. He showed me samples of each of the
respective tubes. The one he didn't have was the original Russian 6L6, as this
is extremely rare, but I have seen it referred to in literature.

He had a whole case of 1540s, with 1959 date codes.

Soviet tube manuals, and books tell the same story. A lot of this literature is
available online, but not in English.

Here's some ebay links for photos

This one is the 6P3S-E, sold here as the 5881

http://cgi.ebay.com/6P3S-E-6L6GC-5881-NOS-Vacuum-Tubes-Lot-o-f8-pcs_W0QQitemZ230217143637QQihZ013QQcategoryZ58174QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Compare the plate structure in this tube, to the Sovtek 5881 you posted a photo
of - it is the same thing.
Post by Phil Allison
** Appearances are not the last word.
You made a COLOSSAL blunder here - admit it.
The more modern "Sovtek" and "Electro-Harmonix" stuff, is of course not covered
in old tube manuals, as it simply didn't exist then. When I noticed what looked
like a normal Soviet tube, with unusual guts in it, I thought I'd ask a question
here rather than delve into researching it.

I simply asked a question. I hope for the sake of you, and the people you live
with, that you don't take yourself as seriously as it appears you do ;)
Phil Allison
2008-02-01 06:09:56 UTC
Permalink
"maxhifi"
Post by maxhifi
Post by Phil Allison
** And all this info come from where ?
When I was in Eastern Europe,
** Fuuuuuuccckk oooffff !!!!!!!!!!!
Post by maxhifi
Post by Phil Allison
** Appearances are not the last word.
You made a COLOSSAL blunder here - admit it.
The more modern "Sovtek" and "Electro-Harmonix" stuff, is of course not covered
in old tube manuals, as it simply didn't exist then. When I noticed what looked
like a normal Soviet tube, with unusual guts in it, I thought I'd ask a question
here rather than delve into researching it.
** You must be utterly INSANE !!..

Read your own fucking stupid heading.

Fuckwit.

And get yourself a digital camera that FUCKING WORKS !!!!



...... Phil
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